Massad Ayoob is a renowned firearms expert with decades of experience in the firearms community. Safe. This is the approach Springfield Armory has taken successfully to its broad line of 1911 pistols. Have to insert a short story here, Hard to hear it through his pants as he talks out of his ass. Just say you are a Glocksucking fanboy. Transition to new platform was a cinch, jack round in chamber press lever down, holster, no safety! I personally shoot my cs sp01 better than any of my stiker fired pistols. Fact: heavier trigger pull makes negligent discharges less likely. It truly is a classic nice and helpful piece of information and facts. In many cases, a pistol manufacturer will offer a variety of systems available on the same platform. She is very proficient at drawing and cocking the hammer for the first shot rather than making the long DA pull. I love my 1911. Pellentesque dapibus efficitur laoreet. Why are you Glocksuckers always desperately seeking validation? Who ever wrote this doesnt know guns or hasnt used them except at ranges. Fire. If that person ever has to fire or even just draw his gun in self-defense, theres an excellent chance that the first arriving police officer will command, Drop that weapon! If they dont comply, theyre likely to get shot. The safety added a small measure of safety. With the underside of the crossbow facing your legs, place your foot far enough into the foot stirrup to keep it from slipping out when you draw the bowstring. Use a Decocking Mechanism when Available, B. Okay? 35 ViS was made IN Radom. Is the 1911 drop safe? Its ALWAYS easier to learn one task (how to manage a single trigger pull weight and movement) than it is to learn two (a long/heavy first-shot pull, followed by a short/light second- and subsequent-shot trigger pulls). Not sure how a striker over a hammer is going to make you a MUCH better defensive shooter. I love the Sig SP2022 I currently own and use at the range and along side the bed at night. In fact, I have a Canik C100 at Cajun Gun Works now that Ill use as my EDC when they finish with it. Okay, now youre not even reading what I wrote, just parroting your fake talking points. the unsubscribe link (where available) in one of our messages. This requires the slide to be racked with the support hand, which may not always be available for the task; one-handed slide-racking can be extremely slow and awkward compared to the simple draw-safety off-fire sequence of Condition One. No problem with it. This method of concealed carry for a DA/SA pistol is not without risk. That was comforting. Decocking a P220 Elite 10 SAO. | SIG Talk To be truly rounded one must be comfortable, at a moments notice, with using whatever firearm is at hand. . As far as I know, they werent much of a concern to anyone in the world until the 70s-80s-90s. Except many of them, Glocks etc, are carried cocked and unlocked, since there is no safety. When worn, They would often fire even if the safety was engaged (Savage 32 was known for this). I have had a 3913tsw since the early 90s. Crossbow Shooting Frequently Asked Questions - BowScanner Its called the ViS. In truth, anyone who can operate a 1911 can operate a DA/SA with a safety. Is the 1911 pistol design inherently dangerous? Should Taurus add decocking functionality the G2C and G3 You are a colossal tool and a Glock fanboy with zero credibility. Its the best of both worlds. Manual Decocking And How To Do It Safely - USA Carry Just bought a PPQ in .22LR, and while Im waiting for delivery Ive been reading up on it. Yes, practice makes perfect and muscle memory, etc,etc. WTF is this talking about? They do make the hammer fall (in most cases). I explain how a rimfire pistol works, why it damages the gun when you dry fire it and how you can safely decock it. First pull sucks, the rest not so bad. Is the 1911 Dangerous to Carry? - The Armory Life It all comes down to the mission. And returns to Safe by itself. If, as one old gunwriter used to say, The purpose of shooting is hitting, then carrying a DA/SA pistol should be nearly last on your list of pistol choices. And so when you pull the tigger nothing happens. K.I.S.S. The first trigger pull takes a little time to get used to if you are more familiar with striker-fired pistols, but it isnt that hard. However, some complain that this system can affect the 1911s enviably crisp and clean trigger pull. Different systems work for different people. If you are already great with the DA/SA, youll be absolutely SUPERB with the other types (again, with the same practice). Only in SEA did we load with six. If youre already superb with a DA/SA.wait, never mind. Decocking a Glock 23 - The Firing Line Forums I always carry hammer-down when concealed carrying. The saying among cops is true: In every fight theres at least one loaded gun present and up for grabs yours!Its an equally valid concern for the lawfully armed citizen. A plastic fantastic glock or other polymer striker fired pistol can do: Block Certain GamesGames are most infected operating systems. Enter in your email and password to create a FREE account. 35, you have it labeled Beretta 92F, hammer down, trigger forward.. And from there, you only have to remember to Draw & fire. Condition Three is hammer down on an empty chamber, with the magazine loaded and inserted. As I said above, if youre good with a DA/SA, youll be great with a quality striker-fired pistol. Exercise caution: Pick the pistol up with your dominant hand and point the muzzle in a safe direction. I can carry it either cocked and locked, OR as a DA by thumbing down the hammer. You know so much its almost hard to argue with you (not that I actually would want to. Options means decisions under stress. Going to move it up next to wanker rails. Knowing how to use what youve got is better than wishing that it was something else. Thoughts on this, or is there another decocking method thats better? We were introduced to the Walther PPK/S with the DA/SA de-cock operation. I didnt find them particularly difficult to master and I remember when our range commands were Decock, make safe and holster your weapon after a course of fire. A DA/SA pistol does allow a heavier trigger pull on the first shot and some people want that. Nam risus ante, dapibus a, onec aliquet. Problems often arise when you are not familiar enough with your chosen pistol and dont recognize its strengths and weaknesses. Its convenient and easy to use. Different strokes for different folks. All the H&K has the perfect decor king mechanism. Obviously not the surplus cop pistol part, but first quality pistol impressions, like first loves, can stay with a person and color their opinions forever. @ James McGillis There are some leftie techniques but they are pretty gun specific. These are something a Glock cant offer. They offer no tangible safety benefit. How To Carry a DA/SA Pistol - Concealed Carry Setup Advantages . The designer, a guy named John Browning, did not intend that. Have carried a cocked and locked 1911 since the service. It's pretty simple but requires that you perform these steps assiduously and carefully. DA/SA cocked and unlocked is just like a Glock. If there's a key to doing this, it's doing so slowly and carefully. For those of us that own/shoot/carry hammer-fired pistols, we occasionally find ourselves in a position where manual decocking is called for. Also anyone who is good enough to compete will have zero issues mastering a double action first trigger pull. The glock trigger is close to my Sig in SA mode, yet the Glock has no form of safety at all! It has three positions: fire, safe, and decocker (which is momentary). He specified hammer down carry. When was the de-cocking lever invented and by whom? Tactical Shooting Drills & Handgun Training, Personal Protection Devices, Tools and Accessories, Clubs, Shooting Facilities & Associations, 24/7 Access to Premium Personal Defense and Firearm Training Videos and Drills, Step-by-Step Instructional Demos and Guides, 50% Off Video Downloads Purchased in the Personal Defense Network Shop, 2 Full-Length Video Downloads to Watch Offline, 9 Full-Length Video Downloads to Watch Offline, 2 Full-Length Personal Defense Classes to Keep for Life, 2 In-Depth Skill Development Presentations, Discounts on Purchase-to-Own Content in the Personal Defense Network Shop. Pistol Safety Flashcards | Quizlet I couldnt find it. In fact the Beretta 92 was my first gun back when I didnt know poop from shinola. Sig P226 de-cocker | Firearms Talk The writer of this article is a complete moron. This is the standard operation of a glock. Just because you or people around you call it something else does not make you or them right. It didnt fall out and the hammer was covered protecting it. Donec aliquet. Nearly all older guns were not what we now call drop safe. On the Beretta, the de-cocking lever doubles as a manual safety. I just dont see the hate. Find me a couple of highly-rated professional carry instructors that insist the best way to carry a SA auto (or a DA/SA auto with a cocked-and-locked option) is with the hammer cocked and the safety off (cocked and unlocked) and Ill happily give you that point. I watched a bunch of videos about how to pull your pistol from a holster and in several of them I saw the gun owner shoot himself with pistols with striker fire. Theyre like the people who call all semiauto pistols a Glock. The hammer is dropped whilst a firing pin block prevents said hammer from discharging the pistol. The latest content straight to your inbox plus an automatic entry to each of our monthly gungiveaways! All is says it PT24/7 including the Pro. Two Stage de-cockers are usually a lever (not a button). This is generally deemed less safe because (A) it requires slow and awkward cocking of that rear-mounted hammer, a task perhaps better suited to an orangutans paw than the human thumb, and (B) it requires pulling the trigger of a loaded gun to safely lower the hammer, which can easily result in a slip and an unintended discharge. As the mechanism is spring-loaded, no other actions are required. Sign up for a membership now! Plus, don't make the mistake of leaving your firearm lying around unsecured. Decades of (self) training left me with a revolver where I fired a couple shots (normally SA because it is FUN!) You DO realize THAT Taurus was on the recall list Geoff? Check the USPSA/IDPA results, see how many DA/SA pistols (again, fired in that manner, not a CZ starting from cocked-and-locked) finish at/near the top of the competitions where they run head-to-head with striker guns and other competing designs. And yet thats EXACTLY how Glocks are designed to be carried, and ARE carried by the thousands of police and private owners. I made the point that it had a thumb and grip safety and Id carry it in a thumb break holster with leather between the hammer and frame. When or if it ever breaks, then Ill consider buying something. All this article said to me in summary, is the author doesnt like safties or decocker and wants me to believe that using them is a safety hazard. They are not my go-to guns today. Others, like on the Taurus 24/7 are combined with the manual safety. Even the most reliable and least detectable. As others state, it isnt very hard at all to do, and you can practice it dry fire, pulling once with hammer down, and then cocking the hammer for the SA portion of the stroke. Springfield Armory recommends you seek qualified and competent training from a There is holstering, unholstering, cleaning, storage, among others, and some people dont want a cocked and unlocked gun like the Glock for their everyday activities for the very rare instance that they would actually need to use it, and desire and want that first stiff trigger pull, or carry it cocked and locked. 3 methods for decocking a CZ / Tanfoglio pistol with a manual safety I trust my fingers more than I trust mechanical devices. Cowboy 101: How To Run A Lever-Action Rifle - Gun Digest Sorry, an error occurred and we could not sign you up. Options mean potential confusion under stress. KEEP THE HANDGUN POINTED IN A SAFE DIRECTION Enable the safety if available Use the decocking lever if available Place non-dominant hand thumb between hammer and firing pin Place dominant hand thumb on hammer Maintain pressure on hammer as you squeeze trigger User: To decock a pistal safely and easily you should safely unload the pistal then utilize the . Am I losing it or were there the following errors in this article: 1. With the first shot, the operator manually cocks the hammer by pressing the trigger, for the following shots, the slide function re-cocks the hammer. The Walther PP was introduced in 1929 with a safety/decocker. Personally I ended up not really caring for the safety on my own Jericho. Were personal injuries lawsuits a serious concern in the 1920s Europe? I cant speak for anything but the Sig Sauer P series and the CZ-75 DA/SA systems, but both work very well in my hands (and for those I have trained to use them). Get exclusive premium content! The basic idea that the trigger is so hard to learn that us stupids in public shouldnt even try and just buy a Glock. The thumb safety added nothing to the safety of 1911s in case the gun was dropped. CZs..the only pistols I shoot. The truth is, heavier trigger pulls are only a big deal if you agonize over them. Proper storage usually requires that the firing chamber be empty and. The SA was awfully squishy, and didnt seem to have a clean break point like my 1911 or SAAs. I love opinion pieces. in the hope that if someone relieved him of his gun, that would give him a few seconds to get it back before he was shot with it, as opposed to a gun which only required pulling the trigger. I heard about it, but AFAIK, mine was not on the list. Yeah well I dont give a hoot what the author says. Id never had a pistol like that before and, at first, thought it was pretty weird. Im used to external-hammer pistols with external safeties that can be decocked easily, but of course thats not possible with this pistol. Thanks, MichaelH- I agree! Experience as an instructor for the M9 as well as extensive personal experience (I owned two 92-F models) indicates: If you are good with a DA/SA auto, youll be great with darn near anything else (and the same level of dedication/practice). Proper storage usually requires that the firing chamber be empty and magazine removed; this includes revolvers and semi-auto pistols. Whatever platform or carry method you use and write about, some internet expert will criticize it. Thats entirely false. This left me with a live round under the hammer, which I could only access by pulling the trigger on 3 live rounds, then 2 spent rounds, before that live round showed up again (speaking, of course, of tense situation not allowing realigning cylinder). Try this on your toy by holding the loaded gun in your left hand, pointed in a safe direction, and then flicking your right trigger finger across the trigger until the hammer falls. 3 methods for decocking a CZ / Tanfoglio pistol with a manual safety - YouTube 0:00 / 2:12 3 methods for decocking a CZ / Tanfoglio pistol with a manual safety TheHumbleMarksman 121K. The pistol must never leave your sight. Carry it that way. my Beretta 8045 the decocker has been worked till it is as easy as a normal manual safety. I have two open carry holsters and I carry with the hammer cocked and locked because I have a strap over the firing pin to ensure it doesnt go off on the off chance of a mechanical failure. obviously, lowering the hammer on a live round aint for everybody. The following tips will help you fire a pistol more maturely and ensure that everyone remains safe during the process. Besides that the DoD frowns upon the use of military rank for commercial purposes which Guns & Ammo certainly was unless it is clearly stated that the person is retired. Striker fired pistols suck!!! My first semiauto was a Sig P229, after 30 years carrying revolvers, and I loved it *because* it used the same safety plan as a revolver, no safety on the gun except the DA pull, just like a revolver, then SA until decocked. So an average IQ person can evidently steer a car, shift into the next gear, drink a soda, and talk on their phone ALL AT THE SAME TIME, but this same person will have training issues with a simple gun decocking mechanism. i do not ever want a longer initial pull. I am quite comfortable relying on the DA trigger pull as a safety. Yup. The Viz is far from the first. sig p22x series have a firing pin block that only gets lifted if the trigger is pulled. That what the DS means. Depends on the model, but not all decocker equipped pistols require extra steps or anything to get wrong during a DGU. Theyre only tough to master if you have excluded your gun use to plastic wunders. COPYRIGHT 2021, THETRUTHABOUTGUNS.COM. And the worst: KeyDemon offers a few words into a computer user ever noticing anything. Several years later we elected a new sheriff who was a 1911 shooter and we were good to go. anyone who cant drive a stick cant drive the gun. Cocked and unlocked. Thats what Id do. My Walther has been flawless Since day one. I dont listen to bombastic phonies. Most da/sa guns have a trigger/hammer block safety (which means the trigger must be pulled back and depressed to align the hammer to the firing pin) similar in function to the glocks trigger safety. So I dont necessarily know this to be true. Pull Trigger. They require an initial press downward to de-cock. Quietly. Im open to be educated but I personally have never heard of a ND induced by a de-cocking lever failing. keep nose pickers out of trigger and good to go. The last two are de-cocker models that I can bring into battery just as quickly as a tupperware gun, but it is more accurate, has less perceived recoil, and is less ammo sensitive than most striker fired pistols. or an instructor who has seen the various problems with effective use of these pistols in actual use. I was wondering sometimes how safe the decockers are. The 2022 in SA has a short distance then it is ready to squeeze another round off with ease. My FNX .45 has a lever decocker built into the safety lever. My wife loves her Beretta 92, and really won;t carry anything else. Nov 8, 2001 A pistol is defensive in concept. And DA triggers have been around a while on revolvers. Archived post. Decock. This author seems to have a its not what Im used to, therefore it sucks mentality. Each one if these pistols sre fine weapons for duty and self defense carry if and big IF the user is trained how to operate them. Its a safety where if you pull the trigger nothing happen. The guy always had strong opinions and spread misinformation that in the pre-internet age could not be easily challenged such as his claim that the 1911 was designed to be carried cock and locked. Give it a rest. I like. Its called capitalism. Well, .40 Baby Eagle more accurately. Good info! New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. Im a fan of this style gun. And, similar to many striker fired pistols, there is no manual safety to prevent me from firing the weapon when I want to. Options mean potential confusion under stress. In fact, they create needless safety and training issues. What Is the Most Common Ammunition in the U.S.. Get everything included in Premium plus exclusive Gold Membership benefits. We have fired thousands of rounds and experienced zero negligent discharges, and not even one incident that I would describe as a near negligent discharge! And if I sent it in I would be without a carry gun and cant afford to buy a replacement. Appreciate your discussing. There is no decision to make when you draw your gun and have a DA trigger pull on the first shot and SA thereafter. I already voided the lifetime warranty by stripping the slide and polishing it. Now a decent DA revodlver isnt that hard to master at self defense ranges of <15 yards. Tags: decocker 101, double-action, pdn, personal defense, personal defense network, semi-automatic, striker-fired. Nam lacinia pulvinar tortor nec facilisis. Its truly not that hard, just learn to lock your firing grip and pull the trigger without disturbing the sight alignment- something you should be doing anyway with any pistol platform. Come back and talk to me after youve spent 2-3 decades training folks how to use pistols, especially DA/SA autopistols with decockers. While I carry a single action striker fired gun, I dont carry aiwb. Sigs at least (dunno about others) also is like a revolver in that the gun will not fire unless the trigger is all the way to the rear. The gun guys in Poland I grew up with called it a ViS. I inherited a Taurus .45 ACP from my Father-in-law, a convicted felon, who had purchased it at a pawn shop in order to shoot a relative that had stolen several 10s of thousands of dollars from him. After confirming no threat, conscious action to set pistol back to safe. But thats just me. and the initials of the designers with the i being the Poilish word for and. So I respectfully disagree. Yes, I know all the mantra about the human being the final safety, the gun is not at fault the person is, etc. Manually decocking semi auto pistols. : r/guns - Reddit People seeme to overlook the fact that we are smarter now from looking at what some smart people came up with back then. plus it rolls the firering mechanism out of line so no chance of it firing while decocking. Wouldnt trade them for anything. Should Taurus add a manual decocking capability, most likely actuated by pushing the safety down past the firing position, allowing a controlled, non-firing release of the striker? My Sig SP2022 has the de-cocker and is DA/SA. Wouldnt trade it for most of the junk around today. Truly were living in a clown world society. You can do the same thing you do with any glock without a decocker. But in the end theyre all just machines and you can learn how to use them if you can overcome your built in prejudices. JER (Joint Ethics Regulations), para. Adding a mechanical firing pin block safety can also work, and some other 1911 manufacturers have taken this approach. The vast majority of people carrying glocks have carried them for decades without issue. They offer no tangible safety benefit. Log in for more information. It has a HAMMER just like my S&W .357! Then the user must manually return the lever to its starting position, to re-enable the firing mechanism. The hammer and the trigger move forward at the same time, and the same function that prevents the gun from discharging if the hammer is struck keeps the hammer from hitting the firing pin. and does not stay down in an inoperable/safe mode. I have both a 1911 and a Hi Power and neither are double action. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); The decocker are away of looking for trouble. Decockers have saved hundreds of police officers when their pistols were pulled from them by bad guys. . In addition to that, the grip fits my hand like it was made for it. Many arms were made to meet government contract specs to be sold The US specified a safety on the pistol or we would have had a US version of the Tokarev. Use H&K compact .45 SA/DA with decocker. It comes down to a reliable weapon and solid training more than anything else. I have a KSN Golan, Israeli Police trade in. Plus, don't make the mistake of leaving your firearm lying around unsecured. I love my old Israeli police trade-in Jericho that is marked IMI rather than IWI. Pretty broad comment. Lets count the fallacies. With pistol in holster (empty), insert a fully loaded magazine in the magazine well and tap it in sharply. Ill admit the first time I dropped the hammer on a live round in my Beretta was spooky for a former 1911 guy! Mar 10, 2012 (Edited) long as you keep your finger out of the trigger guard and off the trigger its totally safe to decock. . Practice makes perfect. (Defense wise you are not precision shooting, pull the trigger not press it). Most early autoloaders were not drop safe with a round in the chamber including the 1911 safety engaged or not. Im not talking of using the cops gun against him. Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit. I much prefer it to using a manual safety, which can easily be forgotten. This type of spyware program installed in less than 5 seconds. Sig Sauer P 226 X-Five Allround 9mm luger, is perfect for me, Im a southpaw. To help you out more, follow these steps to help you clear and store a pistol more carefully: After reading this write-up, you should have a good understanding of how to load, discharge, and clear your pistol safely. Now true, Ive only had a chance to dry fire it, but I much preferred the DA mode to the SA mode. Follow through is squeezing the trigger all the way back and holding it. I have always been surprised that the rest of the industry lets SIG get away with being the only ones to put the dexxxx lever in the correct swpot! has a decocker. lmao what am I even reading? The Polish wz. I also practice swiping the safety off during draws and it is just part of my motion. Or Not. Shoot what you want. AND, you dont really know how good you COULD be. They offer no tangible safety benefit. How to Load, Discharge, and Clear a Pistol Safely, Do not attempt to load, fire, or clear a pistol if you are unfamiliar with it, While loading a pistol, add one round at a time into the magazine and ensure they are correctly seated, Lock the magazine by sliding it upwards till you hear a clicking sound, Disengage the safety latch to unlock the firearm, While discharging your pistol, hold it in your dominant hand and point it in a safe direction, Clear the firing chamber of any unused rounds by racking the slide backward, Loading a pistol can be more complicated than it looks for a new gun owner. Take a close look folks, this is what happens when someone who thinks they know what theyre talking about goes to Wikipedia to reinforce their mistaken beliefs. De-Cocking a 1911 | The Firearms Forum I like my CZ-75D PCR. Press the "magazine release" on the handgrip to eject the magazine. . DA on first round and SA after is pretty simple. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. Now, despite the decock, Im lightening quick on putting 3 4 rounds in a target and at no point in the draw, aim and fire sequence on the first round have I hit anything but the target, anyway. Nam risu, gce dui lectus, congue vel laoreet ac, dict, ac,nec facilisis. Similar to the first time I shot a semi auto shotgun and couldnt figure out how to pump it after I missed a clay. I dont even remember what the problem was supposed to be with them. Thank you Bob. Both the 1911 and Hi Power use the single action/double action, cocked and locked style mechanism. Re: SP-01 and level of safety when decocking the hammer: The decocking version is the safest. But after youve worked a long shift, youre tired, youre in a minor stupor after a long drive home after dark, your mind is dwelling on a problem at work, and then suddenly youre snapped back into the here-and-now by the sight of a person quickly approaching your blocked-in car at the stoplight; well, thats really not the best time to start trying to remember Which mode am I carrying in today?. It depends on the design. The third fail safe is not be pointed at anything/anybody you do not want to destroy. You should be able to run to the fallen cop, grab whatever is in his holster and run it. If you train and your muscle memory is set up for flicking off a safety first, then that is fine too. My only complaint at all is that as Ive aged and acquired arthritis in my shooting hand, the DA seems more and more stiff and painful.