The vast majority of shooters use their rifles for hunting, so we will focus on that application here. However with the huge commercial success of the 6mm Creedmoor, it has caught up to the 243 Win, in ammo availability and often with better performing factory ammo offerings too, so now the 6mm Creedmoor is by far the clear winner between the two in the 6mm Creedmoor vss 243 Win debate. Heres a quick rundown of the pros and cons of each caliber: A six millimeter ARC is the size of a pencil eraser. The 6 ARC can be built on mini actions such as the CZ 527, Howa Mini, Sako AI. Always follow manufacturers instructions. Due to the fact that it uses the 6.5 Creedmoor as a parent case and performs similarly to the .243 Winchester, the 6mm Creedmoor is most often compared to those two cartridges. and 240 Wby. Take that for what you will, but no animal will be able to tell the difference between an additional 100-200 ft-lbs of energy with a well placed bullet though. But what does that mean for terminal ballistics? Cartridge Specs: 6.5 Creedmoor Vs. 6mm Creedmoor Understanding a cartridge's capabilities always begins with basic knowledge of the physical properties of the cartridge. the idea of a 6ARC bolt platform is always lurking in the back of my mind.which intrigues me as I always preferred semis based on a MIL issue platform. At 1,000 yards, the 6mm Creedmoor drifts about a foot more than the 6 . It also has a relatively low muzzle velocity, so it is not as effective at long range as some other calibers. For these shots, high shoulder is recommended. The Big Game Hunting Blog is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com, Amazon.co.uk, Amazon.ca, Amazon.com.au, and other Amazon stores worldwide. Shooters also cannot use bullets larger than .308 or with a velocity higher than 3,200 feet per second. https://www.hornady.com/assets/site/hornady/files/load-data/6mm-ARC-gas-108-110gr-data.pdf, https://www.hornady.com/assets/site/hornady/files/load-data/6mm-arc-bolt.pdf, Peterson Brass Belted Mag Basic Unprimed Box of 50, .300 Weatherby Mag 170 G Hammer Custom Hollow Review help. 6mm Creedmoor vs. 6.5 Creedmoor: Cartridge Clash Depending on how much shorter he actually made it, this could be the case as the rare wildcat 244 Mashburn cartridge also had the same rim, also very little tape in the case body, and also featured a 30 degree shoulder, but this again could not be verified other than that claim. Solutions . For a long time I have wondered about how barrel length affected velocity. A few years later, Gardner was brainstorming ideas on how to gain an advantage in the new Precision Rifle Series competition (PRS) that was rapidly growing in popularity and remembered the project hed worked on with Snow. In short, the 6mm Creedmoor has the advantages of the .243 Winchester (flat trajectory and low recoil) and combines them with the best features of the 6.5mm Creedmoor (wind resistance and the ability to use long, low drag, high BC bullets). The 6mm ARC delivers comparable performance from a wider assortment of bullets, making it a more versatile choice. For 75gr and lighter competition and varmint bullets, a 1-10 twist rate would be fine. If youd rather listen than read, click the appropriate link below to listen to this episode on your preferred podcasting service. So far my "go to" 6GT load is a 112gr Barnes Match Burner at 2900 FPS. However, just to give you an idea of the superiority of the 6mm Creedmoor over the .243 Winchester at long range, consider this: the .243 Winchester has over 30 more bullet drop than the 6mm Creedmoor at 1,000 yards when both cartridges have a 200 yard zero. Image shows 6.5 Grendel cartridge, parent case of the 6mm ARC. 243 wssm, very accurate, very tough brass, 87 vmax at 3200 from a 22" barrel. The Brass is better than 1/2 Price and easily available. I just just spoke to him yesterday and that's what he said he was getting with factory out of his 14.5 suppressed. The difference between the .243 Winchester and the 6mm Creedmoor can indeed make the difference in a tightly contested shooting match, but the gap between them is small enough that very few hunters will notice afield. The 6mm Creed is anout .030 longer than the 6XC. 6mm ARC: Fact or Fiction? Real Performance Results, From-Scratch Comparing 6mm ARC to 6mm CR is is apples and oranges again. Employee communication . .223 and 5.56 are the same bullet diameter (.224") and basically the same brass. Unfortunately, thats not the case with the 243 Winchester. at 2,960 fps. Barnes currently offers their VOR-TX LR line of ammunition in 6mm Creedmoor and its another great choice for big game hunters who want the best possible performance at extended range for hunting. So, the Creedmoor has about 17% more energy at the muzzle than the 6mm ARC. Once this unconstitutional law is struck down or repealed, this restriction will be removed. 6ARC will be cool if Howa ever sells it as a barreled action on their mini action. Heres why: First and foremost, the new ARC is designed to be more durable than its predecessor. Second, I am fully set up with all components to shoot the 6.5 CM. 6mm GT vs 6mm Creedmoor The 6mm GT offer similar mag-fed reliability to the 6mm Creedmoor, with similar velocities, but with slightly less propellant, and is able to use the more forgiving propellants which make the 6mm GT slightly easier for load development with new barrels. This will give you a good, safe starting minimum load to work upwards from. Or does it have the staying power necessary to compete with more established 6mm hunting cartridges like the .243 Winchester? Bullets4Bucks is a participant in affiliate advertising programs designed to provide income. 6mm ARC vs 6mm Creedmoor Shorty? | Rokslide Forum The fact that this was said on such a knowledgeable forum, with no objection by anybody and the first person to mention that such a reamer has been made before by PT&G was in 2010 on that thread. Felt recoil will vary from shooter to shooter and rifle to rifle, but free recoil energy is still a useful way to compare cartridges. Since those rifles also typically have a relatively fast rifling twist, theyll accurately shoot heavier bullets with a high ballistic coefficient. D DocT Joined Alex Pro Firearm - Alexandria Minnesota - APF Armory Find the perfect load for your rifle and shoot accurately. On the other hand, 6mm Creedmoor rifles usually have a faster rifling twist (1:7.7 in the case of the Ruger Precision Rifle), so the cartridge is commonly available with 103 grain, 105 grain, 107 grain, 108 grain, and 112 grain bullets. However, if you are looking for a round that is specifically designed for self-defense, you may want to consider something else. Hornady recommends 1:9 twist or faster for its 105-grain A-Max and BTHP Match. We talk to multi-discipline professional precision rifle shooter, Bryan Zolnikov about his rifle, reloading equipment and load development methods. THANK YOU. Recoil vs cartridge study over the past year and findings. Grendel is a great cartridge, is the 6mm ARC that much better? Not only are these LRX BT bullets specifically designed for the best aerodynamic performance possible, but they still offer the devastating terminal performance and high weight retention under a variety of hunting situations that Barnes bullets are known for. HunterMann Well-Known Member LRH Team Member Joined Jan 18, 2021 Many hunters are still understandably skeptical about it though. 6mm Remington vs 6mm Creedmoor - guncritic.com Case in point. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. How does an "avid reloader" figure a cartridge is capable of outperforming another cartridge that has 50% more case capacity? This restriction is made under protest, but we have to do this to comply with Californias infringement on the freedoms of speech and association of the NRA and our members, supporters, and the general public. Hornady's new 6mm ARC was designed for a specific military requirement; the 108-gr. The size of the bullet, or caliber, is one factor that determines how much stopping power it has. But I am in the market for another bolt action and am patiently waiting on Howa to release their mini action. I have a rifle being built for me right now, a Badrock but it is going to be late summer before I see it. As a follow-up exercise, I plan to use QuickDesign software to create a more accurate model for the 6mm . Actors are trained firearms professionals. Loaded with an 87 grain V-Max bullet at 3,210 feet per second, this is a very accurate and extremely flat shooting varmint hunting load at all practical ranges. As the 6mm ARC factory load is loaded for the lower pressure AR platform. Its also offers match grade accuracy. Since then, demand for the new cartridge has continued to increase and Browning, Montana Rifle Company, Nosler, and Savage have joined Ruger in producing 6mm Creedmoor rifles. Hornady's new 108 ELD-Match needs a twist of 1:8. It is also much harder to control on full-automatic. The cartridges are otherwise identical up to the shoulder and both cartridges have the same SAAMI maximum pressure of 62,000. As a result, the NRA is forced to restrict the sending of certain materials and information into California. So, take all that for what you will. Im shooting 108eldm out of my 6mm creedmoor and really messing them up. As can be seen with the Kudu bull taken at 180 yards late evening with a well place head shot. As their names imply the biggest difference between the 6mm Creedmoor and the 6.5 Creedmoor is the bullet class. bullets. And max velocity can be achieved with stick powders in CM. Why I'm Not Buying 6mm Creedmoor Ron Spomer Outdoors Yes it is designed to run in AR15-platform rifles. The average muzzle energy of the 6mm ARC is about 2300 ft-lbs, while the average muzzle energy of the 6.5 Creedmoor is around 2700 ft-lbs. My 6 creedmoor is a 22 inch barrel. There is also 6mm Creedmoor SRP brass available offering small rifle primer holes for shooters preferring small rifle primers, the only benefit I have actually been able to prove with small rifle primer brass, is that the primer pockets take longer to stretch when running hot loads. You are using an out of date browser. The 6mm Creedmoor or 6Creed as some call it, was a natural evolution as with almost any other 6.5mm Creedmoor that was eventually necked down to 6mm for faster muzzle velocities and lower recoil for PRS style racegun competitions. out of 25 shooters9 picked the 6 creed as the least recoiling round.8 picked the 6XC6 6mm GT2 6mm ARCThe 6mm ARC was built in a Howa action and the 6mm Creed was in a Howa action. I just dont think you could fit a 6 creed in an ar15 platform. 6,685 Location Morrison, Colorado All I see on the shelves around Denver are 6cm, 25-06, and 300wsm. With similar advantages for precision rifle competition shooting as the 6.5 Creedmoor, the 6mm Creedmoor is also a superb competition cartridge, especially for small caliber long range shooting and PRS competition shooting. To further illustrate that same point, consider the supersonic ranges of the three cartridges. ELD-X . The 6mm ARC gives hunters the ability to successfully hunt varmints and deer. 6XC vs. 6mm Creedmoor | Sniper's Hide Forum I get like 2550fps from my 18" 6mm arc ar15 shooting factory 108gr eld-m. If youre in the market for a new rifle, youve probably come across the 6mm ARC and 6.5 Creedmoor calibers and are wondering which one is better. Apple|Google|iHeart|Spotify|Stitcher. All of these cartridges have a very mild recoil that most shooters and hunters should be able to handle. While all three cartridges are known for their exceptional accuracy, the 6mm and 6.5mm Creedmoor cartridges are usually better suited to use high BC and high SD, heavy for caliber match grade hunting bullets than the .243 Winchester because of the aforementioned faster rifling twist in rifles chambered for those cartridges that stems from their target shooting roots. Find Reply Dino11 Member Posts: 350 Threads: 33 Joined: Jul 2020 #2 which is also much easier to find than 6 ARC or grendel. I shot 87 vmax mostly at 2900 fps or so iirc with 8208. What Is The 6mm ARC, and Why Should Your LOVE IT 6mm GT or 6GT, the New 6 on the Block. - LoadDevelopment.com I can't find the weight but I bet it's the one they mention that is only 4lbs 5oz. So, the Creedmoor has about 17% more energy at the muzzle than the 6mm ARC. The 6.5 Creedmoor has a slightly larger bullet than the 6mm ARC, and that extra size makes a big difference in terminal performance. You can get a 6 to 6.5 pound rifle which can shoot high B.C. Hornady 6mm ARC Cartridge - What You Need to Know These factors make the 6mm Creedmoor very forgiving of range and wind estimation errors while at the same time helping to maximize the shooting abilities of the hunter to the greatest possible extent. Makes for a crazy lightweight 6.5 grendel in their Howa carbon stalker. This is especially trueif youre currently having a tough time finding ammo for other similar cartridges (like 243 Winchester). However a 300WM will always beat a 308 given the same barrel length. Click the link below if you just want to quickly check what ammo is in-stock and ready to ship so you can hit the range and get ready for hunting season. bullets from the magazine and not be limited to being a single shot. The 6mm ARC produces a larger splash signature that allows shooters to self-spot impacts and make rapid adjustments. Both of these calibers have their pros and cons, but in the end, the 6.5 Creedmoor is a better choice for most shooters. 223/5.56. There are a lot of opinions out there on which rifle caliber is better, but it really depends on what youre looking for. The 6mm Creedmoor and it's smaller siblings like the 6mm Dasher, BR, and BRX offer all kinds of options to shooters. Regardless of whether youre using a .243 Winchester, a 6mm Creedmoor, or a 6.5mm Creedmoor, no pronghorn or deer will go far if you put a well constructed bullet into the vitals. Dont underestimate the impact that recoil has on the ability of a person to shoot accurately either. It would also be nice if it's a platform that allows me to relatively swap barrels on my ownthe actions that can take Savage/Remage barrel nuts is high in my consideration. But when it comes to long range, and standard short actions, the 6mm Creedmoor beats the 6mm ARC quite far. There is also talk on a post over on Accurate Shooter forum by a person calling himself gnoble, that he built this or a very similar cartridge back in 2001 already by shortening a 243 Mashburn (I think he meant a 244 Mashburn). Im a Reloader and I have a 6 ARC, though its a gas gun. I know there is detachable mags designed for better feeding the short case. These bullets arent quite as heavy and have a little bit lower BC than the Hornady ELD-X, but theyre still very aerodynamic and very accurate. The 6.5 Creedmoor commonly uses 120gr, 140gr, and 143gr bullets. For that reason, it combines incredible accuracy with consistent performance across a wide range of impact velocities. This law also restricts communications that promote an organization such as ours. The .223 does have advantages, though. My buddy claims 2750 fps out of his 18" gas gun 108 ELDM. These shooters we poled shot bench rest, PRS, F-Class and simi auto class. The 6.5 Creedmoor shoots 6.5mm/.264 class projectiles while the 6mm Creedmoor is necked down to shoot 6mm/.243. Ballistics are very similar for the 6mm Creedmoor and .243 Winchester inside 500 yards, but the 6mm Creedmoor is much better suited for longer range shots since it can use those more aerodynamic bullets. 6 ARC vs. 6 BR REM which to pick? - 24hourcampfire Creating a 6mm Creedmoor rifle custom or from one of your current rifles is also fairly simple, you simply use the action of a rifle with a compatible bolt face and action length as can be seen on our bolt face database, and then have a gunsmith chamber and fit a .243 barrel to it. For example,when fired from a Ruger American Predator rifle, a .243 Winchester load firing an 90gr Nosler partition has slightly less recoil than a 103gr Hornady ELD-X from a 6mm Creedmoor. TheHornady 10th Edition(p231-237 and p317-322) reloading manual was also used as a reference for the history of the cartridges and provided data to compare their size and recoil. 6mm ARC Cartridge SAAMI Specs, Build Requirements, Videos The sixmm ARC has enough stopping power to take down small game, but it is not ideal for self-defense against larger animals or humans. The 6mm Advanced Rifle Cartridge (ARC) is a new cartridge by Hornady in 2020. It offers the same stability factor as the industry-leading 105gr Hybrid Target and is a direct replacement for 1:8" twist barrels. similar to a .260 Remington) but with a long neck and the proven 30 degree shoulder angle that is seen so often in the top performing accuracy cartridges. The 6mm ARC produces a larger splash signature that allows shooters to self-spot impacts and make rapid adjustments. If they offered a plus plus P (plus pressure) for bolt action rifles, another 100fps should be in reach. I had a 6mm Norma BR built on a Remington 700 and I could not get it to feed from the magazine. So, if the Ballistic Tip ammo isnt really your cup of tea and you prefer controlled expansion and high weight retention, then this ammo, which is loaded with their 90gr AccuBond bullet, is perfect for you. In general, larger calibers have more recoil than smaller calibers. I am mainly talking to felt recoil. The 6mm ARC came in second place with an effective distance of 550 yards. Like I do with my semi's, rifle & pistol, parts availability, large aftermarket support and readily available reloading components/ammo will need to factor into whatever I decide on. Among others, this list includes the 103 grain ELD-X from Hornady, the 95 grain Barnes LRX BT, the 87 grain Hornady V-Max, and the 100gr Sierra GameKing. What bullet it takes and stabilizes is a function of the barrel more than the cartridge, with the same barrel specs the .243 would actually stabilize the longer projectile better via its higher velocity. 6mm ARC Review : Fad or Viable Cartridge? : Gun University I think my buddy said 2700 fps rather than 2750 fps out of a 18" barrel. John Snows article for Outdoor Life was used as a reference for the history of the 6mm Creedmoor. Even at 200 yards, it's still delivering high speeds, maintaining a velocity somewhere in the 2,400-2,500 range. 6MM Creedmoor; 6.5 Creedmoor; 308 Win; MLR 28 Nosler; 7MM Rem Mag; 300 PRC; 300 Win Mag; AR-15 Complete Uppers 204 Ruger; 22 Nosler; 223 Wylde; 5.56 NATO; 6MM ARC; 6.5 Grendel; 6.8 SPC; 300 Blackout; 350 Legend; 450 Bushmaster; 9MM; AR-10 Complete Uppers 22-250 Rem; 243 Win; 6MM Creedmoor; 6.5 Creedmoor; 308 Win However, the superior ballistic coefficient of the ELD-X bullets used by the 6mm and 6.5mm Creedmoor helps give those cartridges a significant advantage over the .243 Winchester in terms of wind drift of around 4-4.7. This video or description may contain affiliate links. Velocity At short to medium distances, the 6mm ARC and the 6.5 Grendel are fairly evenly matched, with a slight advantage going to the 6mm ARC. Currently 6mm ARC ammo is harder to come by than 6mm Creedmoor. If youre just getting started in long-range shooting, then either of these calibers would be a great choice. 6mm ARC - Wikipedia If you already have an AR chambered in 6.5 Grendel, the ONLY thing you need to change is the barrel. Book an outstandingAfrica huntingsafari here. The .243 Winchester only has a maximum SAAMI pressure of 60,000. Originally dubbed the 6mm HOLE (Hornady-Outdoor Life Express), Snow paired the new cartridge with a custom rifle built by George Gardner of GA Precision in 2009. Update July 2021: Ammo supplies finally look like theyre starting to recover. It features reinforced construction and stronger materials throughout, which should help it withstand the rigors of tournament play. This was basically a 6 arc. A big fan of long-range shooting, Snow was particularly intrigued by the brand new 6.5mm Creedmoor cartridge that had just been released that year. You can boost the performance of the 6mm ARC in a bolt action quite easily. Specifically, those handloads use a 100gr InterLock with a .405 BCand the factory loads use a 90gr Hornady ELD-X (.409 BC) in .243 Winchester to a 103gr Hornady ELD-X (.512 BC) in 6mm Creedmoor, and a 143gr Hornady ELD-X (.625 BC) in 6.5 Creedmoor. Since its still a relatively new cartridge, most hunters probably dont know very much at all about the 6mm Creedmoor. If youd like a more detailed rundown of the strengths and weaknesses of the .243 Win, read this article: 243 vs 308 Win vs 7mm-08: Which Is Right For You? Great questions! It can accomodate the newer, longer and heavier 6mm bullets that offer good ballistic coefficients, whilst still shooting them a fast muzzle velocities without too much recoil. Having a chat with a buddy the other day who insisted that a 16" 6mm ARC would outperform a 16" 6mm Creedmoor using the same bullet (both in bolt guns). I love my Uintah rifle it shoots beyond my expectations for what it is. Why would a guy opt for the ARC over the Creedmoor in a bolt action? This is especially true when relative availability of the 2 cartridges during the ongoing ammo shortage are taken into account. Both cartridges have a much flatter trajectory than the 6.5mm Creedmoor. It can be used for everything from target shooting to hunting, and its also relatively inexpensive to reload.